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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 7:36 am 
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Sea Wolf

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Sorry didn't see this post before

Enforcer wrote:
so each round starts 2 weeks apart, do they play a different clan each round?

can u vote for the same map twice, eg..

emerald, emerald


No

Enforcer wrote:
when assigning players to games can the same person play the same map from each team.


Each player plays 3 battles - it is up to the Captain to assign his resources.

Enforcer wrote:
I think that complete team entrants should be announced about a 2 weeks before the 1st matches start as well as who plays which clan when (assumign that's how it works), then they have a week to enter their not map/map as well as whihc 4 players are playing. Then the maps to be played on are announched and clans have a week to assign players to each game (which are sent secretly to where-ever)


I would've thought that we could turn it around faster than that. Entries could be accpeted up to a given date. Then a random draw would be conducted (single round robin) and published. Each round would have a specified start date. All admin for a round should be doable in a day or so.

In reflection I think this might be better as a "First Team Tournament" and I will probably try and run it in any case. I think a rule something like "Each team may contain at most 1 Marshall (Rocklizard can be a Marshall for the purposes of this rule) and at least 1 player ranked below General in each round"


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:00 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Quitch wrote:
An idea I haven't seen yet would be that on small planets the attacker gets to reject the initial deployment (assuming they're always FNU). This would avoid people being stomped because their SA layout blows.


Hmm, you have me intrigued... What do you mean by this? How would it work? We can restart games in the Tourney Manager, but I can see this as being abused quite easily. The other detraction I see is it will take that much longer before the game actually starts.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:45 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Getting back to discussing the actual war...

Since my "hub" idea doesn't seem very popular, I've been thinking about new starting layouts. Frankly, the only ways I can see to make it even among the clans are A) make it a plain ol' ring, which is kind of boring, or B), use wormholes, which as has been stated, make the overall situation harder to see. I came up with a layout that hopefully fixes the problems with each of these options.

In the picture, the actual systems obviously aren't shown (they'd be decided on later), just where each clan would be in relation to each other. The layout along the rings lets each clan attack any other clan, which isn't boring at all, and lets you see the overall progress quite well on each ring. The inner and outer rings would be connected by 5 wormholes leading between each clan's territory.

Example: Purple advances on Blue, taking several systems. The blue area in the center shrinks, showing that Purple is pounding Blue quite handily. When Purple meets whatever conditions we decide upon in regards to Blue's wormhole, they are allowed to attack through it into Blue's outer ring territory.

The /only/ problem is that hexagonal territories simply won't work. You can't get five clans into an equal arrangement using hexagons without a LOT of wormholes.


Edit: For the record, every clan borders every other clan not because I tried to make it that way, but because that's just how it worked out.


Attachments:
File comment: Relative clan starting areas with systems not shown (i.e., the current clan war map would be just a bunch of colored diamonds).
clanmap.gif
clanmap.gif [ 2.83 KiB | Viewed 16093 times ]

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Last edited by Artanis on Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:57 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Very interesting idea... I personally don't see the need of each clan being able to attack every other one (though making sure each has at least 3 neighbors sounds good). But that is beside the point. I think this is a very good approach. One flaw that I see is that it will not be easy to add new clans as they are formed. Once the war is started, it will not be easy to add new opponents, which is one benefit of the hexagonal approach.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:00 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Enforcer wrote:
we're thoughta bout neutral systems before, but who defends them? does the defender get the planet if he wins? do neutral plaents cost less to invade etc...

Quick idea: maybe have whoever has the most points in the LCW on that particular planet get to defend it and keep it if he wins? That would give the LCW some more importance. Also, going hand-in-hand with it would be the idea to defend it with an LCW player (example: Xantrul defending a neutral Antarticus against Maelstrom), which would give the attacker the advantage he would have against guerillas in MA, and give the LCW player a chance to get experience vs. top-level players without too much at stake.

I'm not saying this'd make it practical, mind you...just a random thought at 7:50 in the morning.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:04 am 
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Sea Wolf

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One problem is that not all clans are part of the LCW


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:45 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Maelstrom wrote:
Quitch wrote:
An idea I haven't seen yet would be that on small planets the attacker gets to reject the initial deployment (assuming they're always FNU). This would avoid people being stomped because their SA layout blows.


Hmm, you have me intrigued... What do you mean by this? How would it work? We can restart games in the Tourney Manager, but I can see this as being abused quite easily. The other detraction I see is it will take that much longer before the game actually starts.


I mean in so far as the FNU player looks at their SA distribution, decides "bugger this for a laugh", and tells the tournament/war organiser that they don't like the setup. The game is cancelled and recreated, and the FNU player MUST accept the second setup.

You could limit this to small maps only as well.

It is the most minor of delays (like adding half a turn to a game), but should lead to less massacres because of crap SA layouts.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 10:35 am 
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Sea Wolf

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i'm all for linking the wars together but if some clans rn't in the lcw then it is unfair to them.

Did consider giving the clans in the main war bonus cash at the start of the week for every point they are ahead of their starting point count in the lcw, and removing cash based on the same idea if they are losing in the lcw. This way clans not in the lcw wouldn't gain or lose anything keeping it balanced.

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Clan War Site: http://www.massiveassault.com/clans/nwo/ClanWar/

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:03 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Exactly, so long as there is a potential downside, all the better. LCW doesn't move at the same pace as the main war though, so bear that in mind.

You could bring in the less experienced players in another way. Say, have a moon or two orbiting each medium planet. Moons/Stations/Orbitals wouldn't generate any resources, but they allow for an in-sector invasion (which I believe is cheaper than invading out of system) of the medium, or all planets (depending on how you feel) making the securing of these vital. Only players allocated to the Little Moon War would be allowed to partake in battles on the moons. This way they play a smaller, yet important role.

I wouldn't suggest having the maps reflect the size of a moon, just evenly allocate out the maps.

That's just an idea though, brings all clan members into one war, but keeps it as two divisions, with both affecting the big picture.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:49 pm 
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Sea Wolf

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can work except what if a clan ahs no-oen in the moon war?

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Have fun, that's an order! If you win even better!!
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:19 pm 
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Supreme Marshal
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I have an idea about new Clan War.
Current rule isn't good for creating large clans, but we don't like split our Clan.
I'd like to suggest other system:
Clan get credits or planets at the beginning due to number of active players. If you have more players you are needed in more resources to allow all of them to fight.
With current rules you can have just 3 marshal in the Clan and don't allow new player join to your Clan. All your players will have enough battles and medium level of your Clan is higher than others.
It's just variant.
As variant we could have two separate regions for large Clans.
My idea was to create map with 6 or 8 sectors (one sector - one clan and round map), but sectors aren't equal length. If clan have more active players, they have additional planets. Otherwise, they have dark area (they get new planets if they lost too many planets or if this clan have new member).
As far as we know universe haven't end :wink:
It's just variant grown wise with experience of the First Clan War and it could be useful for creating one tournament for all players of Clans (without LCW).

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:56 pm 
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Sea Wolf

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maybe a cap on income per clan based on no. of active plaeyrs, eg u can have a max of $10 income per week per player. so 3 active players is max of Ј30 per week

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:17 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Hey man, pick one currency and stick with it, lol.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:04 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Tiger wrote:
Clan get credits or planets at the beginning due to number of active players. If you have more players you are needed in more resources to allow all of them to fight.


It seems to me that a clan with more resources would have more of an advantage (as I discussed with Tiger when he initially presented this idea to me). I can understand the problem though, that being that larger clans have a difficult time getting as much play time for each player.

What I suggested to him was to have sub-clans... split the clan up into multiple battle groups based on its size, each group led by a different clan member, and getting its own resources. Of course, there is still the problem that the sub-clans will work together. If they were isolated enough that they couldn't help each other, maybe it would work. But woe to any clan caught between them...

I still can't think of a good solution to this problem. My clan is smaller than the others, due to the attrition of players leaving, but we still would like to be competitive. I would recruit more actively, but unfortunately I don't have the time to do it properly.

Perhaps we could go with Tiger's suggestion, but make sure those clans have more fronts to defend due to their size. Thus they get enough battles for everyone, and the small clans aren't at as large a disadvantage.

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NWO website:
http://www.freewebs.com/massiveassault-nwo/index.htm

Clan War website:
http://www.massiveassault.com/clans/nwo/ClanWar


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:13 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Well, if there's only two sub-clans and we use the double-ring thingy, then you could have one sub-clan for each ring.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:37 am 
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Sea Wolf

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sub clans could work, as there is diplomacy in the war already, would just mean that it would be more likely to ahve otehr clans gang up against them. Would need to be a minimum number of plaeyrs to get a sub clan tho, else u'd have 1 sub clan for each player if u could :) tons of cash :)

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 Post subject: Clan tournament suggestion
PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2004 3:02 am 
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Sea Wolf

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The problem of large clans is solved by the tournament - each clan can enter more than one team in the tournament.

ie the teams that might enter at the moment.

FOR "A"
FOR "B"
NWO
GOT "A"
GOT "B"
7TH "A"
7TH "B"
RN


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2004 3:07 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Artanis wrote:
Well, if there's only two sub-clans and we use the double-ring thingy, then you could have one sub-clan for each ring.


Very true! This idea is sounding better and better...

Thinking about it, even if the sub clans work together somewhat, I don't think it could cause too much advantage, as they still have their own resources that they can't share. If one part of the clan is suffering, the other would have a difficult time breaking through to help them without opening up themselves to attacks from other fronts.

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NWO website:
http://www.freewebs.com/massiveassault-nwo/index.htm

Clan War website:
http://www.massiveassault.com/clans/nwo/ClanWar


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2004 5:05 am 
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Sea Wolf

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altho what we really want is to have more clans, any way we can help encourage clans to form? How about any new clans that join in the next war will get an extra $100 starting cash to offset their alck of war experience :)

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Clan War Site: http://www.massiveassault.com/clans/nwo/ClanWar/

Dragonshard Fan Site: http://www.rpgplanet.com/dragonshard/


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2004 5:40 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Would the various elements of each clan be competing against each other?

Why the layout change again? Not sure I quite grasp the issues with the old one.

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