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| Voting about system of scoring for draw http://www.massiveassaultnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=3346 |
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| Author: | Tiger [ Sun May 07, 2006 3:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Voting about system of scoring for draw |
Hello, We would like to know your opinion about system of scoring for draw in MAN2. In the old MAN draw was possible only for broken game and don’t give any points to players. In the MAN2 almost impossible to broke game, but players have new option to finish game as draw. Really situation when any side can’t win is very-very rare in the any version of MA, but sometimes it could be too long game, when last units should establish control over empty countries and opponent’s army to do same action in other side of map. Additionally, some games could be played between friends as training or experiment and they both agree before start to finish it as draw. The current system of MAN2 counts the draw as success of player with low rank and he get points, although less than if he wins this game and vice versa – player with higher rank lost points, but less than in losing battle. |
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| Author: | Maelstrom [ Sun May 07, 2006 8:08 pm ] |
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Out of curiosity, in MAN2 is it possible for tournament/clan moderators to get a replay for a specific game directly from the server to determine who won? |
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| Author: | Nick_WN [ Mon May 08, 2006 10:33 am ] |
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Hello, I think we won't count score for draw games ended on the 0 or 1st turn in release version - because players may just dislike initial settings and going to create another game. As for the system, it works based on GLiko rating. So if you and your opponent are of almost the same rank, the penalty(award) is minimal. Actually, I see no reason for stronger player to finish game in draw. But in case he agrees - the score will be re-calculated for both players. Please read this BEFORE submiting your vote. Thank you. |
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| Author: | Brewer [ Mon May 08, 2006 3:17 pm ] |
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If I play a stronger player to a draw, I'd consider that a success and I should get points. Same applies if I allow a weaker player to get me to a draw. I think there needs to be a separation between draw from battle outcome, and draw to void a game thats corrupt, has bad settings, or is unplayable. Adding the option to 'void' a game is a reasonable option, instead of tweaking 'draw' to do something it's not intended to do. Just my .02 -Brewer |
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| Author: | Maelstrom [ Thu May 11, 2006 8:36 am ] |
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Why would you draw a game other than to cancel its results? If for some reason you need to cancel a game, and the other player agrees, why should it even be counted for scoring purposes? I don't see any need for Drawing and Voiding. For me, a Draw is cancelling the outcome of the game. If you think the other player deserves the win then surrender. |
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| Author: | Bokkie [ Sat May 13, 2006 5:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Voting about system of scoring for draw |
Tiger wrote: Additionally, some games could be played between friends as training or experiment and they both agree before start to finish it as draw.
This could be solved if there was a "training" option, as suggested to have against AI too.. A game that doesn't interact with the score at all. Could be handy to get to know maps, possible moves, area that bombers can hit, etc. |
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| Author: | Rextrent [ Tue May 16, 2006 11:25 am ] |
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Maelstrom wrote: Why would you draw a game other than to cancel its results? a Draw is cancelling the outcome of the game. If you think the other player deserves the win then surrender.
Exactly. Surrrender is conceding and an agreed draw is not, and there could be several circumstances surrounding a draw that you cannot foresee. Please try to straighten this out, and apparently(!) the majority agrees...and as we are the ones who play(and pay), it is right to listen. 
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| Author: | ravermeister [ Wed May 17, 2006 6:56 am ] |
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I think that 15 votes out of all the players is more indicative than conclusive. I admit I am one of the lonley six that actually agrees with the current system - guess I am used to the Glicko system from chess where a draw is more common and truly representative of skill. The glicko system will always balance you out in the end... If you lose a few games then you lose a few points and your next win will be worth more. If you win a few, your next loss will cost you more. It all evens out in the end until you find your true ranking. The only way to permenantly impove your ranking is to actually get better. |
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| Author: | Maelstrom [ Wed May 17, 2006 7:31 am ] |
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Major difference between chess and Massive Assault... MA games can take months to complete. Because of that, people's schedules will change, and they may have to call the game because they don't have time to complete it. It seems to me, reasons like that will be the main reasons that people will want to draw a game, not to mention when the game breaks. A draw in Chess is much different. |
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| Author: | Rextrent [ Wed May 17, 2006 7:57 am ] |
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ravermeister wrote: I think that 15 votes out of all the players is more indicative than conclusive.
One problem with polls is that many players don't look at the Forum, and if they do, chances are that they won't look in the right place to find it. I believe that POLLS should be communicated to all players, which would give good and fair results to POLL. Not bad idea, eh?....Except maybe for the Support who has to do it(?).
All players could be sent a message to invite them to take part. |
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| Author: | Rextrent [ Wed May 17, 2006 8:03 am ] |
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Maelstrom wrote: Because of that, people's schedules will change, and they may have to call the game because they don't have time to complete it. It seems to me, reasons like that will be the main reasons that people will want to draw a game, not to mention when the game breaks. A draw in Chess is much different.
Yes. There should be this opening for circumstances and consider: Sometimes players who "get to know each other" might be more willing to agree to a draw for convenience, and it should be painless, much like "not timing out an opponent" due to consideration. [I would like to see the POLLS announced to all players] |
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| Author: | Tryptamon [ Wed May 17, 2006 2:25 pm ] |
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I just accepted a draw because I was offered it and was uncertain of the outcome have I continued the battle. I expected to lose some points, but then I saw I lost 49 points! Whoaa, can I take back that draw?  Makes me wonder how much I would have lost by losing the game...
Everyone knows experience may be offset by initial SA placement, so that an experienced player may lose to a person who is fairly new to the game. Thus it is wrong to punish the higher ranking player. A draw is in effect a truce, and a different way of calculating loss/gain of points could be to consider the percentage of each player. The player with least control and minus percentage should lose points, regardless of rank. |
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| Author: | Rextrent [ Wed May 17, 2006 5:20 pm ] |
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I accepted a draw once, and opponent gained points, and I must have lost rank points....Likely the last time i draw a game. I would rather lose fair-and-square or surrender. |
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| Author: | Tairon [ Sat May 20, 2006 3:40 am ] |
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I would prefer to have two options like Morn has suggested it. Additionaly we need the possiblity to withdraw a draw offer. |
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| Author: | artmax [ Wed Jul 26, 2006 8:42 am ] |
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Draw is draw and it means players are equal in level. I think Glicko system should remain. As for finishing games due to miscellaneous reasons (bad allies distribution etc.), there should be an option to finish a game as draw and TO NOT COUNT IT IN RATING (say, consider it to be a FRIENDLY/UNOFFICIAL GAME). But BOTH PLAYERS must agree to make it unofficial 'cause each player wants to make all his defeats unofficial while his opponent does not agree. Since we have already got draw mode, we need to add just an option to make a game unofficial. |
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| Author: | Rextrent [ Wed Jul 26, 2006 9:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Wow. That sounds great.
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| Author: | Morn [ Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:49 pm ] |
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That's it. Thanks! |
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| Author: | artmax [ Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:35 pm ] |
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But we have not done it yet 
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| Author: | Morn [ Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:10 pm ] |
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Yes, I know but you're going to. 
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| Author: | Rextrent [ Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:39 pm ] |
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Maybe while You are at it, you could redo the LEFT SHIFT, CITY SPRITE HEIGHT ? PLease,please,please..... |
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