This is NOT a complete system.Any corretions,ideas or plans are welcome.Just some set of (maybe) usefull suggestions about how clan system must look like.

Ground assault.

As of now clans have 4 members each.All statements are based upon that.

Each clan has a land divided into 4 country circles.4 countries at each border at the first line,3 at the second,2 at the 3rd and last line of defence (XL map)
In the beginning,to succesfully advance,attacking clan must secure 2 lands(i.e. win 2 fights),then they must choose - either 3 go to assault(raising the chance of securing 2 lands again) or 2 go up and 2 stay to make sure,that should their comrades fall they will not be driven away by victorious forces(if clan fails to secure 2nd ground and have only one defender their forces are pushed back to their land also - the result of the game of that defender with attacking player defines just how much players can advance to counterattack immediately(3 or 4)) At the 3rd line of defence only 1 land must be secured,although securing 2 automatically wins the war.If only one of the attackers succeed the one who guarded the last line try to finish him off with offence(meaning he is playing as PL).The one who participated in the defence of the 3rd line CAN NOT be a guardian of the 4th.If the one who guarded the last line kills the offender then an assault has failed completely.

Also when 1st line is attacked defending clan has 3 players play as FNU and only one as PL.Then who will play who is decided by third person by telling which number is PL or FNU(numeration is chosen by the clan before toss and exchanged with the other clan by mail or any other means,it is NOT known to that person)

All clans have new paradise or wasserland at the center,Anubis or noble rust(their choice) at the third line,Antarcticus on the second and small land of choice at the very border of their territory.

For each land taken points are awarded to the clan(for each land defended too of course).Starting from 3rd line titles are awarded for victory(like "piercer" or "defender") After getting the last land clan gets the big point prize as well as a cup(special for each land) and the option to swap lands.

ALSO - land is not just a speculation - there should be at least a sketch of a map of who has a border with whom.To attack a specific clan that has not he border with them,clan must either a)ask for passage a clan that has(maybe buy it with points) b)conquer that clan;) c)swap lands with that clan

Of course it does not have to start from the fourth line,if both clans agree they can decide to begin from the 3rd or the 2nd immediately.

Sounds like a good idea! It will add one more layer of strategy, and add an end goal to the whole clan war. I still can't grasp the full idea though... it would probably help me to see a sample map of how this is supposed to work.

sounds alot like the campaigns my friend plays n warhammer 40k. =) sounds great to me

Not sure I get what you mean entirely, but it sound prety good to me non the less.

Team effort sounds like fun!

Another tought on this train.

Any way that units could be moved from one battle to another i.e. one clan member sending units to support another?

At the recruitment stage, it could be possible to send all units within say 2 moves of a capital for another player to use in their battle at their recruitment stage. It might need to be on the same turn, or maybe the next turn, so that a losing player couldn't wait for reinforcements.

This would give more of a campaign feel than just a one off battle and it would also mean that you could help out your other clan members. Also it might sort out the situation where one of the clan gets a bad starting position. (You have to admit, sometimes you just get a crap start!)

Or maybe you could save up spare units from one battle to another (within reason) i.e. clans getting stronger and stronger when they win. This would encourage team work from several clan to bring things back into balance.


I'm sure that either of these would be a nightmare to code!

I thought of that too but it will be nightmare not only to code...it will be nightmare to balance in the first place,so I don`t think something like that will appear soon.

MortonHQ and I have been discussing this a little, and here are some ideas we came up with. First of all, since each map is supossed to represent a planet, why not make the clan war map a star map? Each MA map (planet) could be used multiple times, possibly representing the different types of worlds (desert, forested, water based, etc).

First off, we decided it probably wouldn't be good to include Bizzaria in a tournament environment. It is too subject to randomness in Secret Ally distribution and initial unit placement. So we are left with 6 planets: Antarticus (everyone's favorite, I know ), Anubis, Emerald, New Paradise, Noble Rust, and Wasserland.

Secondly, we want to make sure there is a persistant feel to this, to make it seem like a galactic scale war, where a lot is at stake. Then again, we don't want it to last forever, since then it gets old, and you don't feel like you're accomplishing anything if there is a lot of back and forth. We also want to be able to declare a winner and reset it at times (every few months? Haven't decided how often yet).

Finally, we want to make sure that veterans as well as new players can contribute. We don't want a couple people dominating the whole game, we want this to be a team effort.

This idea has a lot of the same ideas Magistr Honna initially proposed, but in a slightly different format. Basically, each clan will have a specified amount of planets to start with. The simple star map I provided shows the planets belonging to two different clans. We could easily add more clans by just duplicating this same setup and arranging it in a balanced way. The larger planets are near the core of a clan's space.

The idea is, in order for a Clan to take control of a planet, they declare some battles. The offense declares what clan member will be attacking, and then the defending clan decides who will defend that planet. The rule is that each Clan member must be used once before they can be assigned to another battle, so you don't want to assign your general to defend against a recruit. This encourages more evenly matched games and allows newer players to contribute more. Also, it allows smaller clans to contribute... they will just play more games.

In order to take the inner planets of an opposing clan, the attacking clan must own two planets linked to it (the white lines). This is using Magistr Honna's idea in a slightly different sense.

Past that, this idea needs a lot of work. Some of the questions we have to answer are:

1) How are battles declared? Are they declared simultaneously then revealed, or does each side take turns declaring battles?

2) How do we make sure each player has at least a couple battles per war round?

3) What is the order of how things are done on each war round?

4) How often should the war be reset with a fresh start?

5) What additional rules should we add to ensure clans have even chances? If a clan is composed entirely of veterans, and another clan has veterans and new players mixed, the veteran team would obviously have the advantage. How can we encourage clans to recruit new players?


One more note. I realize that this idea doesn't really help rate people individually. We're going to need more tournaments or leagues to do that. This is just an idea to use clan teamwork with some very enjoyable goals... galactic conquest.

And one more note... This will not add any additional burden on the developers. I could write a program to keep track of the war state and generate the current map. This map would reside on the web somewhere, possibly in a forum, so clans can keep tabs on their progress. Of course, if the devs want to lend resources, they are welcome to .

How about this as an extention to the above.

Each clan is initially given 2 groups of planets like the ones ilustrated by Maelstrom; these could be kept together or spread out.

Each week, each clan is awarded points based on the number of large planets they control (2 initially).

The points should be allocated evenly across the clan with each member being given 1 point before any clan member gets 2 (that way all clan members get a fair amount of games).

These points can be used imediately or saved up and allow a clan member to attack a neighbouring planet to one that the clan controls (maybe only ones that have at least 2 links). Basically this is how you allocated who will play for the attacking clan.

The defending clan then allocates a defender. Again, each clan member should be allocated once before any is allocated twice, as so on.

The one exception to this could be that a clan member is allowed to play out of turn once, so that a clan can use one of its better players to defend a key planet. This would only be allowed to happen once until each clan member had been allocated the same number of defensive battles. After the balance is restored, the clan member can then play out of turn again if required.

If a clan ever has less than 2 big planets, then a new group of planets should be added to the outside of the galaxy. The same would happen if new clans were formed. This would allow us to start with only 2 or 3 clans and expand as new clans are formed.

I think that by doing this, new clans or clans who get beaten would be pushed to the outside of the galaxy and be able to play clans of a similar level. The more powerful clan would occupy the center and would again play clans of a similar level.

I think a system like this would allow the clan war to continue at its own pace without the need to designate a set number of battle over a set period. Ownership of planets would change on a daily basis. A turn limit of 3 or 7 days could be imposed to avoid undue delay in playing turns.

For the purpose if declaring attacks, a disputed planet would still count as being controled by the defender until they lose.

Also, additional attack points could be awarded for winning clan tournements or leagues as a bonus.

As a last point, I think the defender should always play as PL.

Be sure to somehow leave room or plan what to do when new planets are added to the game.

Very interesting ideas.

Example I hear you cry!

Ok here goes, but don't blame me if it gets messy. I've tried to keep it simple, but I'm not sure that's possible without a verbal explantion!

Imagine 2 clans (A and B) of 2 players (1 and 2) denoted 1A,2A,1B and 2B.

Galaxy map (planets denoted by small letters, control denoted by capital letters)

(a)(b)(c)(d)
(e)(f)(g)(h)

Just say that each clan only has 1 large planet to start with (a) and (h) to make this easier.

Week 1.

Players 1A and 1B are each allocated the first point each. 1A saves his, 1B attacks (b). 1A is allocated as the defender.

End week one.

Total allocated points history:

1A = 1
2A = 0
1B = 1
2B = 0


Remaining points:
1A = 1
2A = 0
1B = 0
2B = 0

Defences allocated:

1A = 1
2A = 0
1B = 0
2B = 0

Disputed planets: (b)


Week 2.

Points are allocated to 2A and 2B (because they are next on the list)

2A attacks (c) and 2B attacks (f). 1B is allocated defence of (c) and 2A must be allocated to defend (f) because he has been used less.

End week two

Total allocated points history:

1A = 1
2A = 1
1B = 1
2B = 1


Remaining points:
1A = 1
2A = 0
1B = 0
2B = 0

Defences allocated:

1A = 1
2A = 1
1B = 1
2B = 0

Disputed planets: (b) (c) and (f)

Week 3.

Players 1A and 1B are each allocated a point, because we start again at the top of the list and work down with each new point awarded.

1A can now attack up to 2 planets at will, because he has saved points. 2B cannot attack this week because he has not points.

2B must be allocated as the first defender for clan B.

Either 1A or 1B can be allocated as first defender for clan A because they both have the same total number of defenses allocated. The order does not have to be the same as before.

Clear?

Ok, I pack my bag....

p.s. hope the colour works I haven't tried this before.

Before you ask, I had capital letters, but decided to try and use colour instead!

Guys, particulary Gardians of Traditions, does this sound at all like what you had in mind?

We're in the process of puting a more detailed map on our site, along with a better explanation of the above (I know it was a bit complicated and garbled) but I'd like to check what you think so far.

We have tried to design the clan war in such a way that new clans can be added whenever they are formed, so if you like, we (NWO and GOT) could give it a try and see how it goes. If it works, others can join as and when they like. If it doesn't, we can change it round a bit and try again.

Might generate a bit more interest if there was a working war that people could look at.

Shouldn't be any more time consuming than playing regular games. Maelstrom (hope you don't mind me speaking for you buddy) and I would be happy to look after the paperwork for the trial run, and keep track of the map and battles on the NWO site to begin with.

What do you say?

just a thought - looking at your "clans" system ideas i think that the word "clan" itself is not fit for sci-fi environment in which MA takes place...clans of players look okay in some fantasy world (resembling medieval earth) but what's a clan in sci-fi?
maybe ones who create player teams should think about more creative sci-fy style names for them
like "FNU Space Marine Corpse" or "7th Army of Phantom League " of "New Paradize Planetary defence" and such

Hi,

This is very interesting and we are almost ready to test it, but I think we should find 1-2 players for our clan or add him later.

You can easily add more clan members once we get started with the current rule set, just as we can easily add more full clans to the fray.

How about starting on Monday the 16th? Just let us know when you can start. Since this is just a test run, the earlier the better so we can start determining what the fun factor is, and adjust the rules accordingly as more people join in. See the War declaration on http://massiveassault.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=473

It's fine.

another way of doing fights could be for each planet invaded more than 1 fight is fought on it between different pairs between the 2 clans involved. Not sure wether this should be fixed (i'd suggest 4 fights meaniung invaders need to win 3/4 to capture the planet) or maybe set for different planets eg a valuable planet would require more fights to take over, or maybe could be harder to take over with say invaders needing to win 5/6 fights fora capitol or something.

I've been in other clan wars or a system silimar to the one you ares have been discussing, in previous ones every day each planet my clan owned gave us so much cash, with these we could invade other planets using the cash to buy fuel to transport our "armies" (was actually mechwarriors) the cash also determined what type of mechs we could use, tho not sure how that would be incoroporated into MA.

Each planetary invasion had 4 fights, with the invaders needing to win 2/3, and then proigressing to the final showdown. Once a clan member had been assigned to a fight on that planet, he/she couldn't fight anywhere else until the planet's conflict was over (this usually took 1-3weeks) So we could use some sort of system like this to force clans to use weaker and stronger members, as we could say there is 3 fights on planet A and none of the clan members in those 3 fights can be reused until all the fights are over (or until a max fight time i'd say no more than a week at which point games are assessed on whatever system the tourney was based on for winers).

Donno these just some ideas i had, have to admit i got abit confused reading thru the current ideas, will re-read them ocne i'm more awake

I like the idea of using a monetary system. Right now we're just using attack points, but a monetary system might make more sense, and give more options.

I like the money idea to.

We've revised the rules a bit to include it. The idea is much the same as before, but hopefully with a better balace between the importance of small, medium and large planets.

A Battle Control section has also been added to the site with details of the credits allocated to each clan member etc.

Initailly, we have dished out 20 credits to each clan member, plus the first weeks allocation, to get things going at a decent speed to start with.

The map will also be updated today or tomorrow with planet reference details (probably a grid reference) so that we all know which planets we are talking about.

To save the forum from getting clogged up, please email details of attacks and defences etc to the following email address.

newworldorder@graffiti.net

It might be a good idea for each clan to create their own email address so that challenges etc can be sent out. That way there should be someone there more often to respond.